France Invaded

Prove Islam is from God, why it is the 'One True Religion'.
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charleslemartel
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Re: France Invaded

Post by charleslemartel »

KufirbintKufr wrote:
charlesmartel wrote:The truth is that there is nobody out there who would/can come and help you. Jesus, Muhammad, Krishna, Buddha and all the others are gone and can't come back to help even if they wished. All they have left are words which may or may not be of much help. No one can help a man other than himself.
That is merely your opinion. I was helped by God many times. Millions were helped by Him. Why do you think Lourdes is so crowded ? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
I don't know if you would believe me, but during the time I was having my initial doubts I actually experimented with praying to inanimate objects like my chair etc. Each of them helped me sometimes and failed me at other times, just as God I earlier prayed to did.

To address your questions, I would ask you some more similar questions.

Why is Meccah so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Tirupati so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Amritsar so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Wailing Wall so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Varanasi so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.

Do you see the futility of such questions?

EDIT: And please! Do realize that you have exactly the same amount of evidence for Jesus/God as Muslims have for Allah, Hindus have for Vishnu or Shiva, and others have for Ahur Mazda or Thor etc?
Islam is a funny religion which is misunderstood by its scholars and correctly understood by ordinary Muslims.
Faith is keeping your eyes shut when looking at the world, and/or keeping your eyes open only for the beauty of the world.

yeezevee
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Re: France Invaded

Post by yeezevee »

what is cooking here Maz Jobrani is good...

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Russell peters
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yeezevee
Last edited by yeezevee on Thu Jan 28, 2010 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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KufirbintKufr
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Re: France Invaded

Post by KufirbintKufr »

charleslemartel wrote:
KufirbintKufr wrote:
charlesmartel wrote:The truth is that there is nobody out there who would/can come and help you. Jesus, Muhammad, Krishna, Buddha and all the others are gone and can't come back to help even if they wished. All they have left are words which may or may not be of much help. No one can help a man other than himself.
That is merely your opinion. I was helped by God many times. Millions were helped by Him. Why do you think Lourdes is so crowded ? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
I don't know if you would believe me, but during the time I was having my initial doubts I actually experimented with praying to inanimate objects like my chair etc. Each of them helped me sometimes and failed me at other times, just as God I earlier prayed to did.

To address your questions, I would ask you some more similar questions.

Why is Meccah so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Tirupati so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Amritsar so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Wailing Wall so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.
Why is Varanasi so crowded? If no one was ever helped there soon the place would be forgotten.

Do you see the futility of such questions?

EDIT: And please! Do realize that you have exactly the same amount of evidence for Jesus/God as Muslims have for Allah, Hindus have for Vishnu or Shiva, and others have for Ahur Mazda or Thor etc?
Beliving in God is hoping against hope. I know sometimes it seems as if God deserted us it is called "dark night" by the mistics.
If you were a Christian I suppose you believed in Satan. Dont you think that Satan could have staged it to mislead you? It appeared to you as if a chair actually answered your prayers.

Meccah is crowded because hajj is compulsory for muslims.
As for the other shrines - well God can answer prayers everywhere. In Mecca too...
I dont think only Christians can be helped by God.

If I could prove my claim, then it would be science not faith.

What made you doubt God if you dont mind me asking ? :)
Galatians 1:7-8
But there are some who trouble (agitate) you, and they would pervert the good news of Christ.
If we or an angel from heaven should preach to you any message other than that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.

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Marie
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by Marie »

HollowScar

Redemption can be found in many ways, but by being a part of a group, an individual finds acceptance.
crazymonkie is right. That is not redemption, it is identification.

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Marie
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by Marie »

HollowScar

There are many strong arguements you can bring, but does it really matter if they are starving themselves, or are just prohibiting. By prohibiting themselves some food, aren't they starving themselves for a certain time?
No they feel hunger, but they are not starving. Some groups here in the U.S. purposely go hungry for a day in order to awareness about people starving in other countries. While they state they have an idea of what it is like to without food for a certain period of time, they acknowledge what they experience is not the same as starving.
I hear the same things about people in Hollywood who donate, but their donations are nothing compared to our tax payments. What can we do?
You don't get it do? What I'm trying to say is wealthy Muslims do not care about the poor.
That's bizzare. Men are men. So, if you imprison a man from abstaining sex, isn't he going to be hornier? I don't know about other men, but I won't chase after my wife (not married yet), but embrace her. Yeah, maybe it is because I am a bit more civilized on certain aspects.
You don't get it. Isn't Ramadan suppose to be about piety and not jumping on top of your wife the minute the fast is over and it's obviously you know nothing about married couples. Married couples ( unless the standards are differen't in the Muslim world ) on average have sex once a week ( there are couples who have sex more than once of week ). The fast is from sun rise until sunset, therefore the husband has time to be with his wife. In fact there is no reason for Muslim men to jump on their wives because the amount of physical intimacy should be about the same when there are no holidays.
Interesting. Were these men even muslims? Was this true for the majority of muslim countries? These are some questions that need to be answered. Now I can show you links on crimes increasing during Christmas, and New Years, but lets face it, what can we accomplish from this?
No they were not Muslims, they were actors pretending to be Muslims in order to make Islam look bad.

So far all I know is a large percentage of Muslim countries have higher road accidents around the holidays from people rushing home to eat, have a cigarette, and exc. after fasting all day.

Crimes increasing during Christmas and New Years? Are you sure you are referring to people committing suicide?
We are not having a press conference here. Every religion has flaws, and deviates us from the truth. Just because Christianity is much lighter does not mean it is the truth. I left Islam for a reason. Now, I cannot find to truthh in any other religion. What makes you think you are on the right path?
I'm a faithhead. I have faith that I am on the right path.

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charleslemartel
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Re: France Invaded

Post by charleslemartel »

KufirbintKufr wrote: Beliving in God is hoping against hope. I know sometimes it seems as if God deserted us it is called "dark night" by the mistics.
Mysticism or spirituality involves losing a lot: your beliefs, comfort zones, conditionings etc. It is not a process of gaining something. They say we already have what we need; one just needs to get rid of unnecessary junk to feel full of light and freedom. This junk is what obscures the reality and/or our true nature. When one starts losing the junk, a time comes when one's hands feel empty. It is in such a time that one experiences the dark night of the soul.
If you were a Christian I suppose you believed in Satan. Dont you think that Satan could have staged it to mislead you? It appeared to you as if a chair actually answered your prayers.
The concept of Satan was one of the reasons for my doubts. However, the chair does answer your prayers sometimes :lol:. Try it sometime.
Meccah is crowded because hajj is compulsory for muslims.
As for the other shrines - well God can answer prayers everywhere. In Mecca too...
I dont think only Christians can be helped by God.
As I have said, any inanimate object would prove to be as effective or responsive as any God in answering your prayers.
If I could prove my claim, then it would be science not faith.
That is one of the biggest cop outs by believers. There cannot be any discussion about unjustifiable faith. Since none of the believers are required to justify their "faith", their claims are all equally valid or invalid.
What made you doubt God if you dont mind me asking ? :)
One, the realization that God is unnecessary. Two, the apparent existence of evil. Three, the only argument for the existence of God (creator?) fails when it comes to God himself/herself.

Anyway, my post was addressed to only HollowScar. He has a mature head on his shoulders and it seemed pathetic to me to see the efforts to convince him about the truth of Christianity. The psychological hold of Islam on its followers is greater than that of Christianity on Christians. If HollowScar could see through the lies of his own religion, and could break free somewhat of the conditioning/indoctrination, I don't think any system of belief is going to ever appeal to him. What I told him needs no belief in any imaginary or invisible entities.

I would suggest that we stop this discussion about your faith. Amongst all the religions, I am against only Islam simply because if it holds sway, it would interfere in/with my life too much.
Islam is a funny religion which is misunderstood by its scholars and correctly understood by ordinary Muslims.
Faith is keeping your eyes shut when looking at the world, and/or keeping your eyes open only for the beauty of the world.

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charleslemartel
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by charleslemartel »

Marie wrote:You don't get it. Isn't Ramadan suppose to be about piety and not jumping on top of your wife the minute the fast is over
:lol: How jumping on one's wife any time of the day is against piety?
Islam is a funny religion which is misunderstood by its scholars and correctly understood by ordinary Muslims.
Faith is keeping your eyes shut when looking at the world, and/or keeping your eyes open only for the beauty of the world.

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KufirbintKufr
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Re: France Invaded

Post by KufirbintKufr »

charleslemartel wrote:Anyway, my post was addressed to only HollowScar. He has a mature head on his shoulders and it seemed pathetic to me to see the efforts to convince him about the truth of Christianity. The psychological hold of Islam on its followers is greater than that of Christianity on Christians. If HollowScar could see through the lies of his own religion, and could break free somewhat of the conditioning/indoctrination, I don't think any system of belief is going to ever appeal to him. What I told him needs no belief in any imaginary or invisible entities.

I would suggest that we stop this discussion about your faith. Amongst all the religions, I am against only Islam simply because if it holds sway, it would interfere in/with my life too much.
I thought you replied to my post. Ok. My last answer then:

HollowScar is free to do whatever he wants. He said that if Christianity was right he wanted to be a part of it. So as you see nobody is convincing him against his will.

There are small things that convinces me that GOd exists- like that voting in Britain:
In a blow to Tony Blair's authority, MPs voted by 288 votes to 278 to back a key Lords amendment to the bill, which targets incitement to religious hatred.

The prime minister voted in the first division but not in the second, which was lost by one vote.
God has a sense of humour.
Galatians 1:7-8
But there are some who trouble (agitate) you, and they would pervert the good news of Christ.
If we or an angel from heaven should preach to you any message other than that which we preached to you, let him be accursed.

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charleslemartel
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Re: France Invaded

Post by charleslemartel »

KufirbintKufr wrote: I thought you replied to my post. Ok. My last answer then:

HollowScar is free to do whatever he wants. He said that if Christianity was right he wanted to be a part of it. So as you see nobody is convincing him against his will.

There are small things that convinces me that GOd exists- like that voting in Britain:
In a blow to Tony Blair's authority, MPs voted by 288 votes to 278 to back a key Lords amendment to the bill, which targets incitement to religious hatred.

The prime minister voted in the first division but not in the second, which was lost by one vote.
God has a sense of humour.
Peace.
Islam is a funny religion which is misunderstood by its scholars and correctly understood by ordinary Muslims.
Faith is keeping your eyes shut when looking at the world, and/or keeping your eyes open only for the beauty of the world.

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Re: France Invaded

Post by iffo »

Marie wrote:
You don't get it. Isn't Ramadan suppose to be about piety and not jumping on top of your wife the minute the fast is over

charleslemartel
How jumping on one's wife any time of the day is against piety?

Nobody can beat you when it come to dirty minds. You guys can not think of anything other then sex ...
Im sure if god say you can not have sex during Ramadan, then you would have complained too, saying what's wrong it that............. you are hopless

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Marie
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Re: France Invaded

Post by Marie »

iffo wrote:
Marie wrote:
You don't get it. Isn't Ramadan suppose to be about piety and not jumping on top of your wife the minute the fast is over

charleslemartel
How jumping on one's wife any time of the day is against piety?

Nobody can beat you when it come to dirty minds. You guys can not think of anything other then sex ...
Im sure if god say you can not have sex during Ramadan, then you would have complained too, saying what's wrong it that............. you are hopless
Your prophet was a dirty old man, rapist, and pedophile who thighed a 9 year old girl and you say I have a dirty mind?

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Marie
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by Marie »

charleslemartel wrote:
Marie wrote:You don't get it. Isn't Ramadan suppose to be about piety and not jumping on top of your wife the minute the fast is over
:lol: How jumping on one's wife any time of the day is against piety?
Well I guess you are the expert on that.

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Re: France Invaded

Post by AhmedBahgat »

Image

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Centaur
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Re: France Invaded

Post by Centaur »

nope
Mohammad bin lying
Click to win $50,0000 :rock:

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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by paarsurrey »

Marie wrote: I'm a faithhead. I have faith that I am on the right path.
Hi friend Marie

Yours is a blind-faith; it is no reason oriented.

It cannot be as the Bible does not have claims and reasons mentioned in it; the Catholics Protestants have to provide it from outside. It was not written by Jesus. It is a dead book; so your faith is a blind-faith.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
I am an Ahmadi peaceful Muslim;bridging gaps between faiths/denominations/sects/religions Atheists/Agnostics/Humanists and working for their unity and brotherhood.

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HollowScar
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by HollowScar »

Marie wrote:
HollowScar

Redemption can be found in many ways, but by being a part of a group, an individual finds acceptance.
crazymonkie is right. That is not redemption, it is identification.
How is Christianity any different? Accept Jesus or go to Hell, which seems to be more like a fabrication, than something which God would create. Also, Satan rules the hell, instead of being punished, while innocent humans, who did not accept the unclear "truth" go to hell.
No they feel hunger, but they are not starving. Some groups here in the U.S. purposely go hungry for a day in order to awareness about people starving in other countries. While they state they have an idea of what it is like to without food for a certain period of time, they acknowledge what they experience is not the same as starving.
Maybe you could incorporate it as part of your faith. You will still go to Heaven anyways, so why should you care. Being hungry just for the essence of it, is like paying tribute to poverty. Donation is part of it. Now, if you want to make that big of a difference, then go and live like Mother Teresa, and make a difference. No one is stopping you.

Then again, you are not suppose to judge, right? I have to. It is not part of my religion, but part of me. I always felt different, and with Avoidant Personality Disorder, life feels like a punishment. I don't blame God for it, as much as I know it is life.
You don't get it. Isn't Ramadan suppose to be about piety and not jumping on top of your wife the minute the fast is over and it's obviously you know nothing about married couples. Married couples ( unless the standards are differen't in the Muslim world ) on average have sex once a week ( there are couples who have sex more than once of week ). The fast is from sun rise until sunset, therefore the husband has time to be with his wife. In fact there is no reason for Muslim men to jump on their wives because the amount of physical intimacy should be about the same when there are no holidays.
Can you explain why Catholic priests are not supposed to get married, while Protestant priests can. Isn't sex making people unholy? When fasting, you are not supposed to procreate. That's all. After fast, you can do that. Now, is everybody supposed to be hungry for one month, without sex. Wouldn't the husbands still jump their wives, after one moth is over? Aren't men pigs? Isn't comparing men to pigs, a big criticism to pigs?

As for married people having sex once a week, it really depends on the potential. You seem like a nice lady, but if I only succeeded in sex once a week, then my wife will likely leave me, or cheat on me. Now we can talk about the potential and kinetic energy of sex, but that's another topic.

Also, it makes sense that men who are willing to have four wives at the same time, have the capacity, to jump start their organs, without much difficulty. I am unmarried, so I do not know, how desperate I can be, when I am fasting.
No they were not Muslims, they were actors pretending to be Muslims in order to make Islam look bad.

So far all I know is a large percentage of Muslim countries have higher road accidents around the holidays from people rushing home to eat, have a cigarette, and exc. after fasting all day.

Crimes increasing during Christmas and New Years? Are you sure you are referring to people committing suicide?
Why does everything have to be so black and white with you? Am I suppose to trash Islam, till there is no respect left of it? When you said that they were actors pretending to be muslim, to make Islam look bad, I really do not appreciate your sarcasm.

You think, Christianity, is full of pious people, who smell like roses, and play delighting music? sh!t happens, and it happens everywhere. In your case, religion is not mixed with politics, so you get to live a freer, and better life.

There are rules, and you follow them. Part of being a human, is to control yourself. If you can't do that, then what can I say. In one murder book, I read about a priest who suicided, and his note said something about the flesh being weak. He said the truth. Now, if fasting is too hard for you, then you can make exceptions. If you can;t make your life work for you, who can? Did Islam say, that work extra long hours, until five minutes before fast, when you chase home, in a hurry? No.
I'm a faithhead. I have faith that I am on the right path.
So are many muslims, Jews, Hindus, and Buddhists. Now, if you think you are following the truth, then to you it is the right path. That's all. We won't know until we die. Now, if you choose to follow religion by heart, then that is your choice.

Exodus 21:17
"Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.

Mark 16:17-18 "And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."

I do not want to state more, as I do not feel like criticizing anybody. We are all humans, and we live in a modern day world, where if God chooses not to give a damn, then why should we?
"Do you remember what you told me once? That every passing minute is a another chance to turn it all around" - Vanilla Sky
"If I could just go back... if I could rub everything out... starting with myself" - The Talented Mr. Ripley

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Marie
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by Marie »

paarsurrey wrote:
Marie wrote: I'm a faithhead. I have faith that I am on the right path.
Hi friend Marie

Yours is a blind-faith; it is no reason oriented.

It cannot be as the Bible does not have claims and reasons mentioned in it; the Catholics Protestants have to provide it from outside. It was not written by Jesus. It is a dead book; so your faith is a blind-faith.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
Paarsurrey, yours is a blindfaith, it is no reason oriented.

It cannot be as the Quran does not have claims and reasons mentioned in it, the shias, wahabis, Ahmadis and exc. have to provide it from outside. It was not written by Allah. It is a dead book, so your faith is a blind-faith.

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Marie
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by Marie »

HollowScar

Maybe you could incorporate it as part of your faith. You will still go to Heaven anyways, so why should you care. Being hungry just for the essence of it, is like paying tribute to poverty. Donation is part of it. Now, if you want to make that big of a difference, then go and live like Mother Teresa, and make a difference. No one is stopping you.
I care because I do and Christ did preach helping others.
Can you explain why Catholic priests are not supposed to get married, while Protestant priests can. Isn't sex making people unholy? When fasting, you are not supposed to procreate. That's all. After fast, you can do that. Now, is everybody supposed to be hungry for one month, without sex. Wouldn't the husbands still jump their wives, after one moth is over? Aren't men pigs? Isn't comparing men to pigs, a big criticism to pigs?
The Catholic Church gets their doctrine of celibate priests because it is believed Jesus Christ did not marry. Protestant ministers marry because we believe there is no such order in the Bible to practice celibacy. Sex it actually a way to create a bond between two people who love each other, it is just the way sex is treated in society that is perverting this.

Where did I say Muslim men do not have sex for a month? The only thing I have state is that they jump on their wives after the fast or the day is over?

Where have I men compared men to pigs?

You think, Christianity, is full of pious people, who smell like roses, and play delighting music? sh!t happens, and it happens everywhere. In your case, religion is not mixed with politics, so you get to live a freer, and better life.
I guess you never heard me use the term religious fat-cats before?
I do not want to state more, as I do not feel like criticizing anybody. We are all humans, and we live in a modern day world, where if God chooses not to give a damn, then why should we?
Then there is no point to living. We might as well blow up the entire planet.

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HollowScar
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by HollowScar »

I care because I do and Christ did preach helping others.
Well, so did many other people, including Muhammad, Buddha, and such. Now, they have their negatives, but just because Christ is superior to Muhammad, does not mean he is the truth.
The Catholic Church gets their doctrine of celibate priests because it is believed Jesus Christ did not marry. Protestant ministers marry because we believe there is no such order in the Bible to practice celibacy. Sex it actually a way to create a bond between two people who love each other, it is just the way sex is treated in society that is perverting this.
In today's world, this bond is not as evident. I think the original manuscript had Jesus as married, but it did not make it to Gospel. He was a man of 30, and not married, which was a bit unusual back then.
Where did I say Muslim men do not have sex for a month? The only thing I have state is that they jump on their wives after the fast or the day is over?

Where have I men compared men to pigs?
You don't have to say anything. A man jumping over a woman, is like an animal humping another. You were not happy with the fact that muslims only fast from sunrise till sunset, so I suggested they should go on like this for a month, but it would still not stop them from "jump(ing) on their wives", when they are done a month later.

You didn't compare men to pigs, but men are in a way hornier. They swear, they lust, they cheat. So if there are muslim men, who "jump on their wives", then are they doing anything wrong? Aren't they married? Are they supposed to go Monk like for one month?
I guess you never heard me use the term religious fat-cats before?
No, I haven't. Care to enlighten me?
Then there is no point to living. We might as well blow up the entire planet.
I am sorry if I made this debate way too personal. This is my current state, where I want to escape, as I don't see a purpose in life going on this way.

There is a point in life, Miss Marie, if we there was only one universal God, with whom, everyone would make peace, and who would give advice to great leaders, so life could go on as best as possible. Wouldn't that be sweet? But instead we live in neglect, and your response is to blow the entire planet. You have faith, and that is all right, but your faith is amongst many, who believe in many different things.

Here's a question, if God does not do anything, because humans are entitles to their own consequences, then why does God bother to have limitations, or restrictions, on the holy scriptures?
"Do you remember what you told me once? That every passing minute is a another chance to turn it all around" - Vanilla Sky
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HollowScar
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Re: The Cross of the imagination of Paul stands broken

Post by HollowScar »

Marie wrote:
paarsurrey wrote:
Marie wrote: I'm a faithhead. I have faith that I am on the right path.
Hi friend Marie

Yours is a blind-faith; it is no reason oriented.

It cannot be as the Bible does not have claims and reasons mentioned in it; the Catholics Protestants have to provide it from outside. It was not written by Jesus. It is a dead book; so your faith is a blind-faith.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
Paarsurrey, yours is a blindfaith, it is no reason oriented.

It cannot be as the Quran does not have claims and reasons mentioned in it, the shias, wahabis, Ahmadis and exc. have to provide it from outside. It was not written by Allah. It is a dead book, so your faith is a blind-faith.
Hey, everyone is entitled to their own opinions. All faith are blind, and only have a bunch of rules, which do not come into reasoning of life.

Qur'an

Qur'an 71;15/16 "moon in the midst of 7 heavens" 37;6 "stars in the lower/nearest heaven" - Moon is nearer than stars.

Qur'an 51;49 "everything created in pairs" - Um, amoeba??

Quran 11;5 "thoughts of the breast (heart)" - Brains??

Bible

Exodus 21:17
"Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.

Matthew 21:21 " Jesus replied, 'I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.'"

Mark 16:17-18 "And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well."

Matthew 24:29 "Immediately after the distress of those days "'the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.'
"Do you remember what you told me once? That every passing minute is a another chance to turn it all around" - Vanilla Sky
"If I could just go back... if I could rub everything out... starting with myself" - The Talented Mr. Ripley

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